My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... Hi everybody!
At first - excuse me for a bad english. So... what's all about - just a try to make a skin for Haiku, enough usable at a low screen resolution. It's not a secret, that not everybody uses giant monitors with 1600x1200
That's why i've tried to make a skin with look-and-feel of original BeOS. Of course, it's not 100% original, but I wanted to compile many ideas together (maybe someone'll find similarity with classic MacOS in headers)...
It looks great on LCD or at well-focused CRT with a matrox/3dlabs (wich have a good RAMDAC) even on a high resolution. But on a some old monitors this image may look blurry'cos it contains some pixel-sized details and it requires a sharp monitor.
Whatever, it's just a first version... i'll try to improve it and draw menus/radiobuttons and so on...
Please, keep in mind that I'm not a programmer 8)
But I'm drawing gui elements, icons and buttons for windows applications...
Platon Haritonov
Comments
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
IMO:
I like this better than some I've seen here lately. But whatever you do, don't keep rounded edges where you have a button. That's an XP trick that's super annoying--especially when a window is *almost* maximized, if you whip up to the corner and click, you actually click through to something below the window you're looking at, which is vile all around. Keep the roundedness on the bottom if you want, just make the top corners square. :)
Some day I'll get around to doing a Panes mockup...
Kev
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
thats a pretty good GUI. I like it
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I like:
- the yellow arrow highlights of active scroll bar buttons, makes them really stand out.
- the bumpy drag-able graphics in Tracker's attribute display(name, size, modified).
dislike:
-the full length title bar. reason: BeOS's short tabs go beyond novelty. They not only help to distinguish Be from other OS's, but they (coupled with "slidey tab action" ) help application switching especially when several apps are maximized.
- the file menu. reason: most of it is wasted screen space. Usually it's 16pixels tall. This can be reclaimed by compacting the file menu into a drop down menu-item. Think Firefox's "CompactMenu" extension. If you've never used it, look at this Net++ muckup by BeosFrance: http://beosfrance.com/muckups/Net++/net++03.jpg
Compare that image with an open window of Net+. IMHO, the extra mouse click that is added my a compact file menu is well worth gaining that screen space. Plus, IMO it is easier to navigate a menu vertically rather than horizontally.
Re: Kev's square top for buttons:
if you're sqauring the top edge, you might as well square the right-bottom corner for the window resizer.
then at that point, 3 out of 4 corners are square. so why bother with 1 round corner?
misc. ideas:
-either in previous versions of BeOS or in R5's MacOS "hidden" decor, there are some GUI elements that i like. Specifically, non-active applications having their scroll bars and title bar reduced to very simple rectangles.
reasons: it reduces visual clutter, by abstracting inactive applications. This would be very handy with applications that have children window, such as graphics programs (think GIMP, Paint Shop Pro that have children windows for tool options, layer control, color selection, ....,)
-the horizontal scroll bar placed under the compact menu|tool bar. This should help to improve mouse mileage. Ex, you are using buttons on the tool bar and then need to scroll horizontally. move the mouse about 16pixels down and you're at the horizontal scroll bar.
$0.02
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
looks quite nice ... just what's the deskbar doing down the bottom :twisted:
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I hate to be the odd one out. But this is too much like other OS's. The parts of the Be interface that made it different and, to most people, special are missing. We have to keep the tab's, at least for the "default" decor. The grip things on the column headers, menus and toolbars are way too windowsish. I like the rounded corners of the window, and if the title bar was cut back to a tab then the rounded corners would be fine. I think the lower corners could stay rounded if the roundness was a little shallower. I do like the indicators on the columns, I think thats being look at for opentracker. Please move the deskbar that position gives me stomach hurt. Always end on a happy note. I like the active window border being highlighted like that, perhaps if it was tinted a bit to keep the title bar distinguished. Overall I'd have to say it's a bit too much like windows for my tastes but it's good to see people finally working on this sort of thing.
next one
... Ok... I'll try to explain my opinion'bout this "skin" and why it looks as it looks... IMHO
1) I know that everythin' concerning alpha-channel (transparency) always hurts programmers 'cos this is hard to implement, but it's a constant conflict between designer and programmer. They usually have absolutely different points of view. So... I'm designer - not programmer, that's why, I don't see anythin' criminal in using transparency (and round corners).
Just take a look at the buttons at the top of the window ("Close" and "Minimise/Maximise"). If You'll draw a square, which will contain a button - You'll not see any transparent pixels in it. In other words - the button's contour is a square - nothin' criminal. Ok?.. And somethin' else. Also I don'understand what's a problem with click-thru pixels in rounded corners of the window. Hm...
2) 'bout full-lenght title bar... I'll try to make a version with usual BeOS tabs... but I never use "Sliding" feature of tabs... personally for me a full-length title is more comfortable thing 'cos it's easier to seize a window and drag it to other location of the screen. Taste differs... I'll think'bout this.
3) The idea of menu, hidden behind single button is good' cos it "saves a pixels" on a screen, but this works good only if menu consists of 3-4 sub menus or else it'll be a "tree" with too many "branches" to be useful. Maybe in a simple applications (like Net+) it'll be good idea.
4) "Please move the deskbar that position gives me stomach hurt." Does it bothers You?.. It's just a scratch!.. I'll draw version with a deskbar at the right top corner 8) Maybe it's a reason of "windowsish"?..
And something new:
Sliding tabs
I too would like sliding tabs!
BeJay
... tabbed one
... take a look at the tabbed version... hot or not? :shock:
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
this last one is great. only thing i don't like is the grab bars on the menus and toolbars. other then that good job!
one suggestion. add shots of different window boarders. there are about 4 or 5 types, check the headers. i think the full title bar look from your first shot could work for the toolbar "miniture" title windows. but keep the tabs on standard.
Re: next one
Articulate writing, but it is damn difficult to read.
I like the sliding toolbar one, with few reservations. Overall I like it more than many other the other concepts and way more than the recent screenshots I have seen of Zeta. Those shiny, yellow tabs are awful!
Like:
*The textured tabs. Something just looks nice about them.
*The yellow slider arrows on the active window. Good use of color to alert the available control.
What would you do with the Deskbar? One thing I just can't abide is that in its default position (upper-right) the arrows on the menus point to the right, even though they will open to the left. I hate that and always move it to the upper-left.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I think they all suck. I like very clean minimalist lines. IMHO.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
@haplishe - I was joking :wink:
I think it's a good thing for users to have the ability to place the deskbar where they feel comfortable with it, plus having a default and optional GUIs is another way the user can setup their workstation to be more "personal".
That's why its good to kick a few ideas around, some will like it, but there will always be someone who it's not the best fit for. I think as long as we build in the customizations (which the Team are), then everything should be fine.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... As I've wrote in the first message of this thread - my english is far for brilliant. The easiest way for me is to write in russian, but I'm afraid, no-one'll understand me. Anyway I'll try to write in correct english. Excuse me. :roll:
No problems! Draw Your own.
... It feels like You're reading my mind :) The next thing, I plan to add to this sketch is a different windows with different size of headers (like an ICBM messenger window)... so here's my plan:
1) Draw different types of headers with different size (little ones'll be tabless - see above)
2) Redraw deskbar - it needs some improvements. Also I plan to draw vertical version of deskbar, enough popular here :wink:
3) Draw elements, still missed. I mean radiobuttons, checkboxes, text form fields, pull-down menus and so on. I'm not a programmer, that's why I don't have complete list of this GUI elements. But I need it! If someone can help me with this - It'll be great!
And something, I want to know. This section of forum named "Creative Design Team" meant the existence of the team itself. Who's this people? Who are in Team? Is there a way to join the team to work together?
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
Re: My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
It's GREAT!!! :shock: :twisted:
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I hate that crap down this side. Not only does windows waste the top 1/3 of your screen with toolbars, but they steal the side as well for crap you never use. :evil:
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
yes the toolbar is big, but the medium customer (on windows) uses the bar.
for haiku he would appeal to one lateral bar to me similar to that one of kde/gnome but with a beos style
sorry for my English
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I always have hated that toolbar in windows XP, please let's not add it to BeOS.
I regularly have 4/5 tracker windows open in one workspace - runnning the same resolution in windows virtually forces you to use 1 maximised explorer window. Gah!
... about "pixel savers"
... I prefere GUI wich uses every possible pixel of the screen at 100%... maybe the best one (from this point of view) was in MacOS Classic, so the worst one's in WinXP... current BeOS GUI is somewhere in the middle of it... for example - I own ancient PowerBook Duo 280. It's screen (imagine!) works at 640x400 pixels and it's enough comfortable to work with MacOS!.. Imagine WinXP running at this resolution! It'll be a pure hell to work, because almost 30% of screen space will be filled with unusable GUI's elements. The perfect solution (imho) is to use different themes, designed to use with different resolutions. 2 or 3 themes will be enough. I understand that GUI, made for low resolutions will be almost unusable at high resolutions due to small buttons, scrollbars etc. As I've wrote at the start of this discussion - I want to made a theme for low-res modes. When it'll "polished" - I'll made the one for hi-res with similar look'n'feel but with bigger tabs, buttons, scrollbars and so on...
Here's 4 new additions. One more'll be added today (It's not finished yet). Please, take a look and say what You think about it!
I've made a windows with two sorts of little headers (wich was requested) - the last shot.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
hu hu dude ! This meltingpot of yellow, purple, black and white in the same menu in deskbar makes me cry ...
Also, this yellow border in Tracker makes it very present and makes the window bigger than it is. Also the stripe in the tab seems like a workyard.
The right menu is not a 100% bad idea, but take off you shoes, stand up and stay one meter and a half behind your screen. The loose of space due of the win Xp right menu will blow you : ) So the idea to put informations in a right menu is not bad, but have to be rethough i think...
Have you seen what i have posted and what was said in the other room about Haiku GUI ? Specially for the tabs a the moment ...
http://www.beosfrance.com/muckups/Net++/Gonx%20style/net++01.jpg
http://www.beosfrance.com/autres/haiku/GUI_01.jpg
ps: your mouse is a bit too .... well ... mickey moused to me :)
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... don't cry, baby 8)
Yellow indicates active application, purple shows selected element...
I'm not 100% understand Your words about this - measure window border at Your sketch and at my (yellow) one... they're the same... isn't it?
... me too, don'be so serious... it looks like You trying to find fault with minor details.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
hu hu :) don't get me wrong, i feel your muckups are far better from what i have seen on this forum (black and red thingsand others), i was joking about your mickey mouse :d
the sketch is the same yes, but the yellow color for the border makes them widther only to the eye ... but it's just my point of view.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
Thanks. Maybe I just didn't understand You. Whatever, everything's OK 8)
... Mouse cursor --> Mickey Mouse. :lol:
I can be wrong, but the idea was to make an active window highlighted. As for me - it's a big problem - to navigate 'thru large amount of windows (for example - Photoshop, Illustrator, Dreamweaver, UltraEdit, 3 web browsers and so on)... I think, that it's a good idea to highlight active window and active application (on a taskbar)... The same's reason with a taskbar with "sub-windows" shows hierarchically (as at the last mockup)... Maybe it's not ideal. But... Let's discuss about it - maybe You'll do it better. Anyway, I hope, We want to reach the same things - easy and comfortable GUI for Haiku 8)
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
nah lets copy mac with itds top bar and dock
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
As far as I know, There's an analogue of mac's dock under BeOS - Dockbert... But unfortunately it lloks ugly (imho) and not so comfortale to use. I Think it's not necessary - to make Dock-like application for BeOS, because native deskbar have almost enough for a comfortable work. Maybe it needs some improvements but not replacement. Mac's top menu bar with it's ideology (container of active application's menu) is one of the best Apple inventions and, I think, It's a basis of MacOS. I think It's not good - to stole this idea. And it doesn't fit into BeOS interface
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
nickjw: What interests you about Haiku? Every post I've seen from you is "let's make it look like Mac OS X", "lets make it work like Mac OS X", "lets make it feel like OS X", etc, etc.
We're trying to recreate and improve on BeOS here, not Mac OS X!
I'm quite interested as to your interest in Haiku - you clearly think OS X is the perfect system so why not just use that? Cost? I for one hope people will switch to Haiku in the future not because "it's free" but because "it's better". And yes, I think it is possible to make an OS better than OS X!
Simon
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
i'm not using MacOS X, mainly because of the prize. My actual laptop is a Samsung, Dothan Centrino 1.5 with a Radeon 9800 and a 15" screen in 1400x1050 and 7 hours on battery. The same configuration costs 40% more ...no way !
By the way, i'm using the AquaDock under WinXp and i really like it cause i makes things easier under Windows ... BUT ... under BeOS, i don't need it cause, like Simon said, the deskbar do the job like i need. Specially with the QuickLaunch of the Zeta Deskbar.
And, i agree with Simon again, if you like OS X, so just us it. It's a very good OS with lots of softwares and games and iCandy things ... and a nice Dock :)
But here we are trying to do something else so please, if you are not looking for something else, i have seen a great forum for you at this adress: appleforum.com :)
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... Right :lol:
I clearly understand, that Dock is a usable thing, and if somebody needs dock - this one'll use Dockbert or something similar, may appear in future. But dock is just an application. And, I think, It will never be a part of OS (as in MacOS X). So use it if You want to use it - c'mon!.. but it's not a subject to discuss here. Please, let me back to the theme - Which elements of GUI is still missed in my sketches?.. Am I missed smthng?
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
here are some stuff i have done last night. They are not perfect, but more researchs.
Waiting for your feedback about it.
Could also someone of the Haiku team give us lines to follow or at least opinions ?
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
Dano minus the pulsing, and a new version of TabView and ColumnListView?
Of all the mockups here, Remi's seem the best comprimise between BeOS and modernity - the BeOS design is from 1996 but still works well (compared to RiscOS's weird marbling effects and OS/2's fugliness, from the same era). Its out of date however, in many ways (buttons, menus, etc), and Remi's mockups seem to update it well.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
haplishe, if GUI themes are possible I expect a lot of interesting things from you.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
haplishe, I think You well understand the funny/toy feeling of beos
I like it a bit but it's not perfect:
try to keep R5 windows border with your tab...
and I think there's too many borders around selected items...
But it's cool !
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... I'll try to reply step-by-step
1) beosfrance: Nothing personal. But it looks as Dano, painted in blue. I like some GUI elements, used in Dano too (and I think - it's good to save'em, they don't need to be replaced), but... So. This is not a complete theme, that's why I can't say more. I'll wait for Your future sketches.
2) h_ank: The people from qube.ru (russian BeOS community) said, that it's partially (~80%) possible to put my theme on Dano's application server. It's possible, but not easy to realize. The same situation's with deskbar. Whatever, we will try. The other way is to make my theme usable under a commerce BeOS distributive (everybody knows its name... hehe :lol: ). But we don't want it.
3) facedeCitron.NIB: I'll make a window borders less "rounded", but I don't like rough style of default BeOS windows. I think, The truth is somewhere in the middle.
2 all: I well understand, that it's impossible to draw a theme, which will be everybody's favourite. That's why my theme will changes regarding Your advices, but general line will not change. The tabs will be yellow, the active window's border will be yellow. The selected element will be blue. I plan to redraw corners of window borders, make buttons little embossed and so on. Thanks to everybody for their help. I'm just trying to do my best.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
MYOB: The blue color was just for testing if it could be nice. In fact, it's not that much, specially when it's big ... i think i will get back to an old grey one for others.
... a little addition
http://dirtyexposed.nm.ru/images/obos_new_tabs_db_5.png
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I think haplishe's design is very good, but there are 2 things I don't like:
-The buttons in the "Copying" window. I think that when there are several buttons, and some of them have shadows while some don't, it creates a "messed up 3D" look. The shadows give a feeling of height, therefore the buttons appear to not be aligned.
-The mouse cursor -- it looks cartoon-like.
about buttons
... Thanks for pointing to my mistakes - I plan to redraw the buttons to give them volume, the buttons on a copying window will be fixed... the shadowless button is a disabled button - it can not be pressed...
... About cursor: I think it's good idea - to give a possibility to change cursor's look to a user. I prefere to use "Color wave" cursor scheme under windows for 5 years (try to search in google for example, it's easy to find)!! The cursors in this scheme are just triangles with animated color "wave" movin' through cursor - it's color shows system's condition - ready, busy, not available etc. This cursors are preciese (you'll see a pixel wich will be pressed) and not too little for a high resolution. I think, everyone must have a possibility to change cursors - "hand", "triangle", "arrow" and so on... that's why I'm not focused at cursor's look. Maybe someone will like my "mickey mouse's hand" 8)
... wait for updates!
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
eh eh .. ithink here we should stay on a default theme, so not personnal mouse cursor or funny things like that. But keep them for R2 :) I was in fact thinking of building something similar to www.wincustomize.com for BeOS ... wallpapers, mouse cursors, icons sets, sounds sets, windows theme, ...
But we have to wait for R2 before to think about it ...
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... I don't want to disput - That's right. The main goal is to recreate classical BeOS look in R1. That's why we can stop everything, related to Haiku's look 'till release of R1. But I don't want to wait. I think, it's good to plan R2 GUI today. We have enough time to resolve all problems and "polish" it to the moment when programmers will be ready to implement it in OS. It'll save up a large amount of time - when software will grow to be possible to change "skins", cursors and so on - at least one skin will be 100% ready (or maybe more than one!).
to HAPLishe:
Dear HAPLishe!
You beautiful skin can be used in R1! Already!
Khe, khe. In R2 there will be already quite another windows. And doors :lol:
P.S.
AntiGrainGeometry rulezzz!! We have that to what all the other Longhorn's and KDE/GNOMEs will get ouch as not soon!!! (and DarkWyrm is God!)
Khe, khe it is probably possible to compare our graphic engine only with Aqua, but... it's cool!
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I like it and want it and don't want to wait for it because I want it.
Re: to HAPLishe:
... Thanx! If it's possible to "wear" it on R1 - let me know how to make it. I'm not a programmer and have no experience of code GUI components. All I can to do is just to give a sources (PSD) to a person, wich can turn this sketch to a real "skin"...
Imagine, me too!
Like it
I like your work as well haplishe, and it tickles in my stomack seeing this pics "of Haiku" (as I would like to see it at least).
Good work, keep it up. You should be a part of the Creative Team. You seem to know your things :)
Re: Like it
Thank You. Imagine, I dunno' who's Design team, who's this guys. I think, thy're not visiting this forum and "live" in specialised newsgroups or somewhere else. I never communicate with them. And when I've asked 'bout whos's Design Team - nobody answered me.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I'm not sure there is a huge design team now. Stubear was the team lead, but may have disappeared. There wasn't an urgent need for design team stuff when the project began, so any organisation that was put in place then might not hold up now.
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
I think Haplishe's concept shots are excellent! They seem to be inspired by stubear's (also excellent) concept shots and are a nice blend between the existing R5 look and the Dano look.
I also like the fact that the window tabs only sit along the top of the window so they can still be slid (why on earth this functionality was removed in Dano is beyond me).
I think the two things I particularly like are the rounding of edges on the menu items and the deskbar shelf area and the use of a single colour (in this case yellow) in the various widgets. I also like the yellow border around the current active window (draws the eye but isn't over-the-top) and I really like the cartoon-style mouse cursor - it shows that Haiku is an operating system that doesn't need to take itself too seriously, which is what using a computer should be all about.
Looking forward to seeing more concept shots!
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
Haplishe, I love some of the concept screenshots you've put together, but i'd like to give my opinion too :oops:
so far, obos_new_tabs_db_5.png is near perfection.
I dislike the progress bars, the nicest thing about non-blocked progress bars is seeing it slowly slide from left to right, having pauses between highlighting each block, to me, gives a slower perception of time.
The cursor is great, but it does just need a minor tweak away from disney-fication. But i'd still love to see it in a children-orientated theme.
The highlight on selected tabs {3.png} should be changed, either to engulf the entire tab, or leave it alone & just tweak the font - It kinda draws attention to itself when of course it doesnt need to..
Hope you keep them coming
*typo
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
haplishe made great concepts! :D
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
BTW, where'd this go? I haven't been to this thread in awhile, so I missed it. Seems like the server is down...
Kev
My version of GUI. Your opinions, additions are welcome
... Right, but AFAIK, the haiku application server is on the way... I think, if GUI design will appears at the moment, app server will be completed - It'll be good...
Who's "Stubear"?... please, send me his concepts to haplishe@yahoo.com - Inever saw them :shock:
... Right... I'll think'bout it
Thanx!
Unfortunately, NM.RU, where images hosted, is free, but horrible... please, try again a little bit later